He did have a connection to some unsavoury types. This book looks like one that I would enjoy.
By Stephen Young
By Stephen Young
By Stephen Young
By Jim Schutze
By Rachel Watts
By Lauren Drewes Daniels
"But if you really want a proper perspective of the Dealey Memorial," Manchester wrote, "the northeast window on the sixth floor of the warehouse is incomparable."
It's a little obscure, but the dots Manchester was trying to connect were Dealey family...Morning News...Oswald...famous Carcano. He based the accusation on editorials and columns in the News that had fanned the flames of right-wing extremism in Dallas before Kennedy's visit and death.
Sitting on a bench behind the School Book Depository on the day of the National Geographic re-enactment, Jerry Dealey, an insurance salesman, assassination expert, JFK tour guide and a great-grandson of one of G.B. Dealey's brothers, says Manchester was off a couple of notches. When Manchester figuratively looked down on the memorial from the sixth floor, he had the wrong Dealey in his literary gun sights.
The right Dealey, the one Manchester probably meant to go after, was Ted, who was editor of the News at the time of the assassination. Jerry Dealey says the guy depicted in the statue, Old G.B., who lived from 1859 to 1946, was actually kind of a pinko: "G.B. Dealey was much more liberal and more left-wing," he says.
"He was very pro-Russian. He almost bankrupted the company in the '20s, because he fought against the Ku Klux Klan...When he died in '46, his son Ted took over, and Ted was a stinker. He went the opposite direction, very right-wing."
After the Kennedy assassination, Dallas was called "City of Hate" by people around the world who hated it for what happened in Dealey Plaza. And as City Manager Suhm says, Dallas still owns that pain.
That does not mean, however, that Dallas owns Dealey Plaza. Conover Hunt, a museum and historical consultant in Virginia who was one of a handful of experts and activists who designed the Sixth Floor Museum before it opened, says Dealey Plaza belongs to the world.
"Dealey Plaza doesn't really belong to Dallas," she says. "It belongs to everyone. And not necessarily just the American people."
The city's pain, shame and chagrin were much more tangible in the late 1980s when the museum was being planned. From the very beginning one mission of the museum, Hunt says, was to expiate those terrible feelings in the only way possible—by bringing them back to daylight and handing the event itself back to history.
"There will always be in any of our tragic historic sites where major history was made," she says, "a sense of collective ownership. It's neutral ground.
"People will go there, they'll go to Gettysburg, they'll go to Mount Vernon, to the Washington Monument, to these battlefields, the good history and the bad, and they will ponder the meaning of life, the meaning of government, and they will talk about it.
"These places are like debate parks," Hunt says, "where you can engage in the discussion and feel the power of history under your feet."
Debate park is a great term for what's going on at Dealey Plaza during this long day of the National Geographic re-enactment. An older man in an orange vest hired to do crowd control for the film crew has forgotten his duties for the moment: He is pounding the ample breast of a tourist woman with his forefinger, telling her in an authoritative voice, "I believe that he was perfectly capable of making that shot."
That would be Oswald.
And isn't it wonderful for an ordinary man to believe such an extraordinary thing with such authority? Whether he has any idea what's he's talking about, it's still a marvel to see a citizen so wired to the history of the place.
Jackie Kennedy, who is actually Angela Martin, an actress from Fort Worth and a dead ringer, is pausing a few feet away in the shade of a tree after making a quick run into the famous School Book Depository Building. "They have a little bathroom for us in there," she says.
She was glad to get out of the car and take a break from being shot at by the burr-head on the boom lift. "It's just a little creepy sitting out there in the car," she says with a very demurely Jackie-like smile.
In the crowd watching the re-enactment from the School Book Depository side of Elm Street, Eric Cannon, who moved to Dallas from Cincinnati three years ago, says he came down to Dealey Plaza this morning looking for something to do—his first visit.
"I did find the vendors somewhat of a resource as far as pointing things out," he says, "giving us some information as to what we're looking at. I like the way Dallas has not tried to change this area, but they let progress continue."
Across the way, three rockers in town for an appearance the night before at Poor David's Pub are making mildly snide observations about the elderly black Shriners, who are still doddering on the hill, their fezzes tipping this way and that like windblown blossoms.
"Are they part of the re-enactment?" jokes Bobby Long, from England.
He did have a connection to some unsavoury types. This book looks like one that I would enjoy.
-chic ornaments Let me just say this...I have been honored to have had many worldwide visitors allow me to show them the highlights of the Dallas we take for granted.
Let me just say this...I have been honored to have had many worldwide visitors allow me to show them the highlights of the Dallas we take for granted. I can absolutely say this: No matter if they were from Russia, France, China or Australia one common thread abounds between them all; they all want to see where that moment in time occurred and are still infatuated with the legacy in such a way that is disturbingly. The respect and interest is absolutely staggering for so many that had no sensable reason to exhibit any knowledge of, or deep reason for being there.
I like this guy ,standing on the facts of truth .has caused the death of many people,why not harrasment .Groden is doing a good job for all of us in America.
Here's the litmus test of 11/22/63: do you believe a mob-connected snake (Jack Ruby) was working or grieving when he stalked Oswald on 11/22, 11/23 and ultimately 11/24? Was Ruby so patriotic that he had to kill LHO to spare Jackie the torture of returning to Dallas to testify? Or was he working? Was he ordering red, white, and blue bunting with all the long-distance calls to Chicago and New Orleans in October '63? Or was he working? Figure out Ruby and the rest falls into place. Someday, the government will release it all...primarily to show future generations that they can, in fact, do what they want, when they want, to whoever they want. Up to, and including, killing the head of state in the middle of the day, in the middle of a major American city, in the middle of the street, in the middle of a crowd.
And lie about it.
You guys just like to spout off your mouth with out doing any research. Oswald was a very poor marksmen and his co-soldiers state he had "maggies drawers" meaning he often couldn't even hit the target at all. Look it up and quite spouting lies.
Google the National Guard for your zip code. No results. Directed to the national site.
The most covert org in the world. Right under your nose!!!
And you question the cover up?
Really? Do you belive the the US is the only country in the world that does not train 12 year olds to be assasins? Get a clue. Go stand on the grassy knoll and then tell me this was not a huge cover up.
Everyone is dead. Last time I checked dead people don't talk.
The National Guard is around the corner from where you live in any where USA. What do they do in there? Right under your nose?
DPD Chief Curry:
"We don't have any proof that Oswald fired the rifle, and never did. Nobody's yet been able to put him in that building with a gun in his hand."
Who I am Doesn't Matter, but hear what I say here. I was in the 6th. grade when J.F.K. was "MURDERED" in Dallas that day. I've heard that Russia did it, the Mafia did it, and that L.B.J. had a hand in it. But both 6th. grade classes went to the cafeteria, turned on the T.V. and sat and watched the President get shot over and over as they replayed the scene. I remember Jackie crawling out on the trunk of the car,and the news report saying that "HE" was shot from behind. Well, even a child of 12 at that time knows you don't go TOWARD danger, you go away from it. It didn't take me long to figure it out....SHE was getting a part of his skull. I mean the NEWS did report that J.F.K. had been SHOT from behind. I didn't see any body part of any one fly forward.Like the film showed..JFK SLUMPED FORWARD..THEN SUDDENLY FLEW BACKWARD his head seemed to hit the back of the seat. I wasn't as smart as those on the Warren Commission at the time but LIVE COVERAGE can't LIE. So if you still want to believe people trying to cover up the facts that a whole nation watched LIVE on LIVE NEWS COVERAGE. Then you're either STUPID, or you didn't see it, or you hadn't even been born yet. NUFF SAID.......
Governments lie, people! When has the government ever told you the truth about anything? How long are you going to keep buying those same magic beans?
One of the more interesting aspects of someone like Robert Groden who believes in a conspiracy is the fact that they never subject the actual idea of conspiracy to critical analysis. As has been noted many times, including in comments here, you have to be fairly credulous to accept the existence of a conspiracy that has supposedly been air-tight (but for the valiant Grodens of the world) for almost half a century.
I am convience that Lee Oswald was involve with something but he didnt know what are who,he was just doing his part.you can tell this man was so confused in the dallas hallway's being led room to room,that all he saw was cameras and media he didnt even know the president had been shot! then when he had time to think,he realize he was being charge of shooting the president and this is when he started sayin he was just a (patsy).So in my mind the FBI, and secret service had a hand in it,ortherwise they(SS) would not "repeat" would not have called the agents off the back of Kennedy's limo comming out of the airport..I have watch all the viedos and all the witnesses testomy for years and it ashames me to think this country allow this to happen and to let the real killers get away with it.Realy how dumb can we pretend to be.
Jim, thanks for making the story as complex and multi-layered as it is. Clearly the City of Dallas is wrong but you opened it up in a fascinating way.
Mr. Groden is a good man who for a very long time has spoken out on the events surrounding the assassination of JFK. Is it because as he speaks about the case he is selling books and cd's? Is that not what is being done on the first floor of the Sixth Floor Museum?
Is it the selling of books or, is it his version of his story the city of Dallas is upset with?
Very true, Dealey Plaza is place of great pain for many people in my generation, but a greater pain is that after close to fifty years we still don't know the true facts of JFK's murder...
Leave Mr. Groden alone, is there not more important things for the City of Dallas to worry about....like crime.
Let Mr. Groden speak
For years, I believed all the conspiracy stuff about the assasination. The Zapruder film is tough to argue with - it sure looks like the fatal shot came from the front.
But, secrets are hard to keep. The more people who know the secret, the exponentially more difficult it becomes to keep it. The conspiracy theorists themselves tell us the conspiracy was huge, the cover-up even huger. It's been almost 50 years.How is it we know (really KNOW) nothing more than we did then?
Maybe it's the 9/11 conspiracy nuts who have soured me on anything conspiracy-related. Maybe I've just grown intellectually lazy on the subject. I don't know. But I just can't believe the theories any more.
"The wonderful thing is, his theory is not entirely implausible."
That's the wonderful thing about all crackpot hypotheses. They all have that grain of truth at the center that never holds up under the harsh light of day, no matter how many miniscule coincidences and questions crop up.
Look, the federal government can't even deliver the mail. What makes anyone think that anyone involved would be capable of orchestrating this kind of coverup, lasting for more than 40 years, and involving thousands of people? It's just not plausible.
Sorry, Bob, but there is definitive evidence done by experts to prove that Oswald, an ex-military sniper, could easily take the shots. And, once you position the respective parties in the limo at the height and angle they were really at, the "magic bullet" disappears.
Get over it and join us in the 21st century.
Get a life Don Abbott. You know so little about Jack Ruby, Oswald and the investigation of the events of that weekend.....Mob-connected snake? Ruby was NOT a nice person, but his connection to the mob was no more than yours Dufus. And I'll bet you are one of those fools who have wasted months claiming that President Obama is not a real American.
Oswald qualified as a USMC Sharpshooter when he was in the Marines. Why don't YOU do a bit of research, symboy?
"LIVE COVERAGE can't LIE" but "Frank James" can. He could not have seen any film replayed "over and over" on live coverage because there were no TV news cameras rolling in Dealey Plaza, and the Zapruder film was only published later as still frames in Life magazine, and not shown on television until Robert Groden ran it on Geraldo Rivera's talk show back in the 1970s.
You are only stating your own opinion on this not any facts. Try reading what I recommended above and see if you think there has been no critical analysis applied to this issue. And the conspiracy was never "air-tight" - it leaks like a seeve, you just have to pay attention to those who talked, those who died because the talked, and those who were never listened to. Check out "JFK and the Unspeakable - Why He Died and Why It Matters" by James W. Douglas (pub 2010), available in paperback at amazon.com and amazon.ca.
"Maybe it's the 9/11 conspiracy nuts who have soured me on anything conspiracy-related. Maybe I've just grown intellectually lazy on the subject. I don't know. But I just can't believe the theories any more."
So you'd rather just buy what the government spoon-feeds you? Yeah, that's a brilliant conclusion... As for 9/11, there's a mountain of evidence that contradicts the 9/11 commission report.
Do some research before you get "soured on anything conspiracy-related". If you can't do that, you have no right to be soured.
Think for yourself:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
Try reading one of the newest and best JFK Assassination books - "JFK and the Unspeakable - Why He Died and Why It Matters" by James W. Douglas (pub 2010). It is one of the best over view texts. It will revive your interest no doubt. Plus with the help of newly released government documents (under the auspices of the Assassination Records Review Board) as mandated by the JFK Act which forced US government agencies to release many assassination related documents and allows you to get a chilling glimpse of the big picture. Try it - you won't be dissapointed. Available on amazon.com and amazon.ca.
yeah, listen: the cia ain't the FUCKING post office, pal. can you even begin to comprehend the dimensions of that FUCKING agency, or the nsa, for that matter? you wanna talk nothing's possible, when EVERYTHING is possible. come join the post-nuclear age, won't you?
I left something out of my first response that is quite important. Oswald was not a trained sniper. He was a radioman who'd been trained to fire a rifle as part of his basic training. The rifle on which he was trained was much easier to use than the rifle found in the building. He was never even trained to shoot at moving targets. After his initial training, moreover, Oswald fell out of practice, so much so that by his last test in 1959, he barely qualified.
When asked about Oswald's shooting abilities, a Marine Corps Colonel told the Warren Commission he was a"poor shot."
These are the facts. Look it up.
Baywolfe, if you'd actually look into the case, you'd find that the army test-fired the assassination rifle for the Warren Commission, and were not able to have ANY of their 14 rapid-fired shots hit as close to the center of their head and shoulders targets as two of the three shots supposedly fired by Oswald, even though they were allowed practice shots, when Oswald was not, and even though they were firing on stationary targets. In short, NONE of the top shooters to fire Oswald's rifle came close to replicating his supposed feat, and anyone telling you otherwise is blowing smoke.
Oliver, how did you know I'm a mobster? Phone tap? President Obama, unfortunately, is all to real to all Americans. Oh, and let me guess, you were probably born less than 30 years ago...in some economic backwater like Wichita or Corpus.
is that crack you're smokin' any good? any major dude could tell you that oswald was a first class marksman. of course he had help (whether he was even aware of this is'nt relevant) and that's really the crucible of this whole sorry episode. and yes, nixon was in town. but then was'nt bush in texas, or en route, when reagan blew the plan and survived? to say nothing of the lennon assassination. just sayin'..