Danny Clinch
Audio By Carbonatix
At this point, Jason Isbell is an artist who needs no introduction, even among the most casual of country/Americana listeners. His previous tenure with the Drive-By Truckers is continually eclipsed by his ongoing solo output, which constantly takes up real estate on the Billboard charts like it’s a Westdale building in an arts district.
Few artists can boast of being nominated for four Grammys, especially considering each of Isbell’s four nominations resulted in wins. You would also be hard-pressed to find another artist whose burgeoning film career already includes a role in an upcoming Martin Scorsese movie (Killers of the Flower Moon) and a just-released HBO Max documentary that was created in his honor (Running With Our Eyes Closed).
Isbell’s achievements don’t need a promo cycle to speak for them, which is why he resisted the urge to uphold a glib, Leave It to Beaver-style portrayal of his creativity with his wife, singer-songwriter Amanda Shires, in Running With Our Eyes Closed. Instead, he and Shires grit their teeth through the bitter unpleasantries that a seasoned publicist would ordinarily urge their client to keep secret, all for the sake of making an honest portrayal of a songwriter who, even while playing to thousands of adoring fans on a 5-foot platform with professional lighting, has his flaws and vulnerabilities just like everybody else.
But then again, the brutal sincerity of Isbell’s character and story is something that strangely appeals to fans. Like many other artists, Isbell lived in the tumultuous throes of substance abuse and achieved sobriety after an intervention and a stint in rehab. But unlike the archetypical rock star, Isbell’s candor about this period didn’t come in the form of a “tell-all” autobiography that some 26-year-old ghostwriter wrote in a studio apartment in Williamsburg.
Isbell comes about his story honestly and without embellishment, while also sparing us the ritualistic self-flagellation and “I was a wild animal” humble-bragging.
How does he do it? Hell if we know. But after our conversation with him, we have the exclusive on his shooting cases of Bud Light better than Kid Rock. We also talked about Isbell’s friendship with Denton bands Slobberbone and Centro-Matic.
(This interview has been condensed and edited for clarity.)
There’s this theory in psychology called the narrative identity theory, and it basically holds that we view our lives as a movie where we are the main character, and the events of our life contribute to an ongoing story arc. With that in mind, what part of the movie of Jason Isbell are we in right now?
The movie’s over. The movie just came out a couple weeks ago on HBO. It’s done, so now the movie is over, and I get to live happily ever after. [laughs]
Yeah, that and the Martin Scorsese movie is what inspired that question.
I mean, I don’t think I see my life that way. I see it more as a series of movies that I am making, rather than one big, long movie that I’m in. Because people complain about three-and-a-half hours of a Scorsese movie. They would complain a lot [over] 44 years of this.
I’m in the middle of a second act, that is for sure. One that is very fulfilling, and where I [am] very grateful for where I am in my life to all of the things that I have and the people that are around me. But at the same time, I think I still feel challenges with the same intensity that I felt [about] 20 or 30 years ago.
Luckily, most of my challenges are logistical and creative and are not actual threats to survival.
I guess that’s a good problem to have, but at times, it must still be a problem. It’s not an easy line of work.
It should still feel like a problem. You’ve got to care about something, and I’m a big proponent of living moment-to-moment, trying to be aware and stay[ing] in the present. When you do that, you get faced with a lot of challenges. I think your body and mind are conditioned to respond to these challenges in a very similar way that I might have responded to challenges that were actual threats earlier in my life.
When you get on stage and you play, you’re giving what is essentially a curated highlight reel of your creativity, but in the HBO documentary, there was a special vulnerability displayed by you and Amanda. Am I crazy for thinking that?
Oh, no. It was hard. It was definitely a more vulnerable process than I would have liked. I was uncomfortable with it, and I know Amanda was, too, but I think that’s what you have to sacrifice sometimes in order to either make art or be part of someone else’s art. I felt like at the time, I just followed the rule that I [have] that if something is difficult to make, it’s probably worth making. And I just kept telling myself that over and over while the documentary was being filmed and while that record was being made.
I think it’s proven to be true; we certainly didn’t make the type of documentary that’s just for promotional purposes. I think it connected with some people in a way that made it matter a little bit more than a promotional documentary would have.
What I’ve noticed about marriage is that it amplifies the good and bad in your character. This is kind of an introspective question, but have any of your good and bad qualities changed for the better, worse or indifferent as a result of being married?
Well, yeah, it just makes you more human.
Like any ceremony, if it’s done with intent, it makes you more human and it reminds you of the fact that you’re connected with other humans, so that’s going to heighten all your tendencies [and] character traits. I think that’s what it’s supposed to do. That’s why we volunteered for this.
Marriage is not really a good idea on paper. Also, starting a rock band is not a good idea on paper. It’s only a good idea once you’ve made it work. Up until then, it’s like, why would you ever do this to yourself?
Basically, a lot of marriage to me is accountability. I promise to hold myself accountable to this other person. If you pick the right person, it can be a really beautiful thing. Because you’ve got somebody who doesn’t have ulterior motives and isn’t trying to manipulate you or use the relationship for their own selfish benefit. If you get somebody who is looking to create a sum that’s greater than the parts, then it can be really good for encouraging personal growth. It certainly has for me. I’ve made psychological leaps and bounds that I never would have made had I not been married to Amanda.
On a different note, how did you meet the guys from (North Texas bands) Slobberbone and Centro-Matic?
I met [Centro-Matic members] Will Johnson and Scott Danbom at [University of North Texas]. The Truckers were playing in the parking lot of the football stadium right before a football game. It was terrible booking. I don’t know who booked us to play that – that was [Truckers vocalist] Patterson [Hood]’s doing – and we scared everybody off. I think we opened with “Buttholeville.”
There was like, kids in cheerleader costumes and stuff standing around and getting ready for the game, and we open with “Buttholeville” at 2 in the afternoon. We were half hungover and half drunk already. It was early on for me, so I didn’t really know the songs too well, so I was nervous [and] looking down at my guitar, and when I looked up, almost everyone was gone. And Scott and Will were standing there with their beers high in the air and cheering us on.
I’ve been friends with those guys ever since.
And actually, I will have [Centro-Matic member] Matt Pence in the band for [the May 9] show [at The Factory in Deep Ellum], and at the end of May, Will Johnson will take over. And I think we will keep Will with us for a good long while. Hopefully permanently.
But, yeah, I met the Slobberbone guys right around that same time. We went out on tour with them in 2002 with the Truckers, and I think Slobberbone was headlining most of those shows. [So] we immediately hit it off. Those guys were all the first real friends I made on tour when I started touring with the Truckers.
So even though you’re now sober, how much ammo and cases of Bud Light are on your rider?
All the Bud Light. I have all the Bud Light on my rider. I don’t drink any of it – I just shoot it. But I buy it first so Anheuser-Busch gets the money. Much like what Kid Rock did, except I don’t get another person off-screen to shoot for me, and I don’t miss. So that’s the only real difference between me and Kid Rock, is I don’t miss.
Jason Isbell and the 400 Unit play The Factory in Deep Ellum on Tuesday, May 9.
